ibd2328

iTrader: (2)

After compiling tons and tons of data, I've decided to start working on adding dual T3 turbos to my 5.4L. Luckily I have lots of software and the ability to tune anything imaginable with my modis and maple sim software. Im contempating on adding an SCT Livewire from franchi for on the fly tunning, but most of my tunning will be right from maple sim and CAD. I am just not getting the results from my testing, and they are a bit off, but I am getting more and more familiar with the system and programming.

I picked up two T3's at a local junkyard today for 75 bucks each. It will prolly take a while to fully complete the build, but with summer coming I can deal with it.

I've been calculating alot of different things with my program, below are some examples. More info as I get into making the own short tube headers.

The graphs are a bit off scale due to me starting the tune at 700rpm and looking for max torque at 2300-2500. I will work on tweaking them some more. I have my max torque where I want it, but it needs to be a bit more gradual so I need to work on the sizing of the pipes and manifold pressure.

4x4dave

What brand did you get? T3's are pretty small, but 2 might do the trick! get us some specs and pics

It will be cool with someone doing a turbo build!

ibd2328

iTrader: (2)

I'm not looking for massive gains, just a few steps up from a sc and torque at a different rpm. Yea the t3's aren't very large, but so far they have been workin volumetric wise.


Pics coming soon. Thanks Dave

Franchi Motorsports

iTrader: (9)

Ohh shiny! Subbed...

4x4dave

Cool! What are your power goals? Just curious...

If you end up rebuilding one of the turbos, maybe you could do a single hybrid t3/t4 turbo. I've seen lots of guys who use the t3 turbine section, with the t4 compressor section. That way you can cram in a larger compressor wheel on the 2nd turbo. Spooling wouldn't be a big deal either, since the 1st baby turbo will get the other one ready to roar when you really step on it. TT F150 is going to kick *** either way!

ibd2328

iTrader: (2)

I honest sold the kenne bell and picked up a garret 88mm. However, after some research and math I went down to some smaller ones. Power goals: hoping to see about 550 tq. Could care less about hp. I'll run a mock up dyno later at 12 psi later and post it.

I'm still calculating the volume of pipe to the compressor wheel to maximize torque at 2500rpm.

Thanks for idea about the t4. And Franchi I'm in the market for a tuner now.

ibd2328

iTrader: (2)

After researching I am seeing alot of guys use those T3/T4 hybrids on their 4.6's and 5.0's. So hopefully this will work for my setup.

ibd2328

iTrader: (2)

Some more useful stuff...
The time it takes to go from no boost to full boost is a function of your total intake volume before the throttle body:

Time = (volume in cubic feet of intake/ CFM of flow out of boost) x ((60 sec/min)/(1728in^3/ft^3)) x 2

Velocity = airflow/area

CFM out of boost is roughly your hp @ a given RPM x 1.5. The 2 is a 50lbs head deduction that when going from no boost to boost, the airflow through the system doubles).

So how do you figure the volume of your intake? Here’s some pointers: I ASSuMEd that my intercooler was 300 cubic inches. Also, I made an educated guess that the total length of the intake piping would be about 9 feet. If you want to get ****, you can estimate the small diameter from your two turbos into the IC, then the distance of the larger pipe to the throttle body.

For piping volume, V = ((diameter of pipe/2)^2)* 3.14159* length of pipe in inches

2” pipe x 9’ = 340cubic inches
2.25”pipe x 9’= 430 cubic inches
2.5” pipe x 9’ = 530 cubic inches
3” pipe x 9’ = 763 cubic inches

Plugging into our time to fill, plus adding the intercooler volume of 300cubic inches,

2.00” pipe x 9’ = .244 sec
2.25” pipe x 9’= .275 sec
2.50” pipe x 9’ = .311 sec
3.00” pipe x 9’ = .393 sec
3.50” pipe x 9’ = .491 sec

What does this mean? If you choose to use 3.5” piping in your system, and are run up on by some ricer in a Fast and the Furioused stickered out STi, it’ll take ½ a second to go from no boost to full boost for your little 60mph to "show him who’s boss" mph. That ½ a second can seem like an eternity when you really need it.

The flip side of this is that going too small can cause unwanted turbulence. For most of us that will only reasonably need 750cfm for a 500bhp 5.0, then the following velocity of the air charge applies:

2.00”: 573 fpm
2.25”: 453 fpm
2.50”: 367 fpm
3.00”: 255 fpm
3.50”: 187 fpm

jollyroger331

What do t3 turbos come out of that you got them from a junkyard. I am deffinitly looking forward to this.

ibd2328

iTrader: (2)

This is a list of all turbos that can be used for a twin turbo setup.

BUICK GNX 87 3.8L GAR TB0348
BUICK Monte Carlo/Regal 78-83 3.8L carbed GAR TB0348
BUICK Riviera 80-85 3.8L GAR TB0308
BUICK Grand National/T-Type 86-87 3.8L (Intercooled) GAR TB0348 (TA48)
BUICK Trans Am 89 3.8L GAR TB0348 (water)
BUICK Century 78 3.8L GAR TB0301
BUICK Century 79 3.8L GAR TB0304
BUICK Century 80 3.8L GAR TB0308
GMC Syclone/Typhoon 4.3L Mitsu TDO6 17C/10cm2

CHRYSLER Conquest, Intercooled 87 2.6L MHI TD05
CHRYSLER Laser (Auto) 90-94 2.2L MHI TD04 13g
CHRYSLER Laser (Manual) 90-94 2.2L MHI TD05H 14b
CHRYSLER LeBaron 89-92 2.5L MHI TE04H
CHRYSLER LeBaron 88 2.5L MHI TE04H
CHRYSLER New Yorker 88 2.5L MHI TE04H
CHRYSLER New Yorker 84-87 2.2L GAR TB0335
CHRYSLER Town & Country 88 2.2L MHI TE04H
CHRYSLER Town & Country 84-87 2.2L GAR TB0335
CHRYSLER Charger/Shelby 87-90 2.2L GAR TB03 (water)
CHRYSLER Shelby CSX-Daytona/Baron GTC/Shadow ES 89-90 2.2L GAR TB03 VNT (variable nozzle)

DODGE 600 88 2.5L MHI TE04H
DODGE 600 85-87 2.2L GAR TB0335
DODGE Aries 88 2.2L MHI TE04H
DODGE Caravan 89-90 2.5L MHI TE04H
DODGE Conquest (Intercooled) 87 2.6L MHI TD05
DODGE Daytona 89-92 2.5L MHI TE04H
DODGE Daytona Shelby 88 2.2L MHI TE04H
DODGE Daytona Shelby 84-87 2.2L GAR TB0335
DODGE Lancer 89 2.5L MHI TE04H
DODGE Lancer 88 2.5L MHI TE04H
DODGE Lancer 85-87 2.2L GAR TB0335
DODGE Omni 85-87 2.2L GAR TB0335
DODGE Shadow 89-92 2.5L MHI TE04H
DODGE Shadow 88 2.5L MHI TE04H
DODGE Shadow 87 2.2L GAR TB0335
DODGE Spirit 89-92 2.5L MHI TE04H

EAGLE Talon (Manual) 90-94 2.0L MHI TD05H 14b
EAGLE Talon (Auto) 90-95 2.0L MHI TD04 13g
EAGLE Talon (Manual) 95-98 2.0L MHI T25 (45 trim)

FORD Mustang GT 85-86 2.3L GAR TB0344
FORD Mustang GT/T-bird 83-84 GAR (AiR) TB0344
FORD Probe GT 88-92 2.2L IHI RHB52W
FORD T-Bird 85-86 2.3L (auto) GAR (AiR) TB0344 (45 trim oil only)
FORD T-Bird 85-86 2.3L (Manual) GAR (AiR) TB03 60 trim (watercooled)
FORD T-Bird 87-88 (water) IHI RHB52
FORD Fiesta 90+ 1.6L GAR T2
FORD Escort 84-86 IHI RHB5

MAZDA 626, MX6 88-92 2.2L IHI RHB52W
MAZDA 323 GTX turbo 88-89 1.6L IHI RHB52W (water)

MERCEDES 300D, SDT, TD 78-84 3.0L GAR TA0301
MERCEDES 300SDL 78-83 3.0L GAR TA0301
MERCEDES 300SDL (Calif.) 86-87 3.0L GAR TB0359

MERCURY Capri 85-86 2.3L GAR TB0344
MERCURY Cougar 85-86 2.3L GAR TB0344
MERKUR XR4Ti 85-88 2.3L GAR TB0344

MITSUBISHI Eclipse (Auto) 90-94 2.2L MHI TD04 13g
MITSUBISHI Eclipse (Manual) 90-94 2.2L MHI TD05H 14b
MITSUBISHI Eclipse (Manual) 95-98 2.0L MHI T25 (45 trim)
MITSUBISHI Galant (Manual) 88-94 2.2L MHI TD05H
MITSUBISHI Starion (Intercooled) 85-87 2.6L MHI TD05

PLYMOUTH Acclaim 89-92 2.5L MHI TE04H
PLYMOUTH Caravelle 88 2.5L MHI TE04H
PLYMOUTH Caravelle 85-87 2.2L GAR TB0335
PLYMOUTH Conquest, Intercooled 85-89 2.6L MHI TD05
PLYMOUTH Laser (Auto) 89-94 2.0L MHI TD04
PLYMOUTH Laser (Manual) 89-94 2.0L MHI TD05H
PLYMOUTH Sundance 89-92 2.5L MHI TE04H
PLYMOUTH Sundance 88 2.5L MHI TE04H
PLYMOUTH Sundance 87 2.2L GAR TB0335
PLYMOUTH Voyager 89-90 2.5L MHI TE04H

PONTIAC Sunbird GT 88-90 2.0L GAR T2
PONTIAC Sunbird GT 84-86 1.8L GAR T2
PONTIAC Grand Prix 89-90 3.1L GAR T25 (water)

SAAB 9000 (16V Intercooled) 87-88 2.0L GAR TB0356
SAAB 900 (16V Intercooled) 87 2.0L GAR TB0339 (Oilcld)
SAAB 900 (16V Intercooled) 84-86 2.0L GAR TB0339 (Oilcld)
SAAB 9000 (16V Intercooled) 85-86 2.0L GAR TB0343
SAAB 900 (8V, APC) 82-84 2.0L GAR TB0321

VOLVO 200 82-84 2.3L GAR TB0313
VOLVO 740 89-93 2.3L MIT TD04H
VOLVO 740 87-89 2.3L MIT TD05
VOLVO 760 89-93 2.3L MIT TD04H
VOLVO 760 87-89 2.3L MIT TD05
VOLVO 780 85-87 2.3L GAR TB0363
VOLVO 780 90 2.3L MIT TD04H
VOLVO 780 87-89 2.3L MIT TD05
VOLVO 940 91-93 2.3L MIT TD04H
VOLVO 200 Watercooled Upgrade 82-84 2.3L GAR TB0368
VOLVO 740 (Oil Cooled) 83-85 2.3L GAR TB0326
VOLVO 740 (Watercooled) 85-87 2.3L GAR TB0363
VOLVO 760 (Oil Cooled) 83-86 2.3L GAR TB0326
VOLVO 760 (Watercooled) 85-87 2.3L GAR TB0363

VW Passat, 97+ (oil) 1.8L GAR GT15

GAR=Garrett=AiResearch, MHI=Mitsubishi Heavy industries, MIT=Mitsubishi


Note that most of them are for engines between 2 and 3 liters. These are the best size for a 5 liter because 2 of them would equal between 4 and 6 liters.